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- Our topic today is on
Agritourism Operation Checklists

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and Self-Assessment.

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My name is Lisa Chase.

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I'm with the University
of Vermont Extension

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and the Vermont Tourism Research Center.

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And I am really happy that today with me

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we've got a whole crew from Rutgers.

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I'll turn it over to them in just a moment

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to introduce themselves
but I wanna mention

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by way of introduction that
I've been using their checklist

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for years and sharing their
checklist with farmers.

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I wanna say it's been about 15 years now

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that I first came across
these Rutgers checklists

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and started sharing them
with Vermont farmers.

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And at one point I thought,

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"Oh, we should really have
our own checklist in Vermont."

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And I started to redo them and we said,

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"Hold it, these Rutgers
checklists are really universal."

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They're not specific to New Jersey

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and we don't need to reinvent
the wheel here in Vermont.

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So even though it might've
been a little embarrassing

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at times to be working for UVM

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and handing out these checklists

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with the big Rutgers logo on
top, I had no problem doing it.

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And I have to say many
farms that I've worked

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with in Vermont have used these checklists

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and have been very grateful
for the ability to do this type

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of self-assessment.

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Type into chat and let us know who you are

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and where you're from, you're
with a farm or Extension

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or some other type of organization.

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And in particular, if there's
any questions you have

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at any point, you can feel
free to ask a question.

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And now I'm gonna stop my share

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and I'm gonna turn it
over to Brian and Michelle

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to take it away with
their Rutgers colleagues.

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- Lisa, thank you very much.

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And just for the record, we
have no such embarrassment

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about using Vermont
resources here in New Jersey.

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So I think actually you
just gave a perfect segue

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for just a few introductory remarks

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that I'd love to share with the group.

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So, first of all, it's really a pleasure

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to be with everybody.

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I'm Brian Schilling, I'm Director

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of Rutgers Cooperative Extension
down here in New Jersey.

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I'm also the Chair of the Regional

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Northeast Extension Directors,
what we call a NEED.

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And we represent 12 states
and the District of Columbia

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and the 16 land-grants within the region.

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And one of the goals
that we have long held is

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to increase programmatic
collaboration across the region,

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leverage the strengths

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of our respective land-grant institutions.

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So Lisa, I really commend you

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for coordinating tonight's
effort and the efforts to come

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in coming weeks and all
the Extension colleagues

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on the line that are here to participate.

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The one beauty about,
well there's many beauties

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about our land-grant system
but one of them is the fact

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that I never feel encumbered
by not knowing an answer

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because I more often than not

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nobody knows somebody who has the answer.

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So again, us coming together as a region

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I think is a real value
and the topic is wonderful.

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So agritourism in our
region is clearly critical

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as an economic development
strategy for many of our growers.

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And I was just commenting
in a national meeting

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about the Northeast

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and the fact that from
West Virginia to Maine

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which constitutes the NEED,

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Northeast Extension Directors region,

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we have over 65 million
people, it's remarkable.

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Here in New Jersey if you put
a dot in our geographic center

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and go out a hundred
miles, call it a generous,

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getting the car day trip
type of commuting distance

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we have one 10th of the US
population with 1 trillion,

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folks that's where the TR
trillion dollars in their pockets.

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So it's such an incredible
opportunity for us.

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So the reason that what
we're talking about here

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this evening is so important
is that COVID presented

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some threats that clearly
were potentially devastating

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to this industry.

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So before I go on and
give a brief context,

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before I pass this over to Michelle.

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I'd like to introduce who's

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on the line with you tonight from Rutgers.

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First is Michelle Casella,
who is a colleague I've known

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for many years, who chairs our
agritourism working groups.

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So she's the one that keeps us all in line

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and makes sure that we show up

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and we're prepared to
do what we're gonna do

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as we are tonight.

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So Michelle's going to walk through

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a number of our resources.

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We also have a team of
very experienced ag agents

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with expertise in
agritourism, direct marketing.

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I think that Rich
VanVraken who you'll have

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the opportunity to see later

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as we open it up for discussion has been

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with Extension for four decades.

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If he hasn't seen it, it's
because it hasn't happened.

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And he's somebody who has worked

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with direct marketing
for much of his career.

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We have Bill Bamka and Steve Komar

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who have worked in areas of food safety,

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pardon me, farm safety.

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One of the things that
you'll hear us speak about

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is in our general program and
tourism is one of the dangers

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of farms is that farmers know the farm.

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They can walk across the
farm in the dead of night

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and not trip over anything.

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You gotta look at a farm

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through the eyes of a six year old boy

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who's just looking for mischief, right?

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So we have some very experienced
people that can help guide

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and provide guidance to growers
in the area of farm safety.

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And then Meredith Melendez is also

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with us tonight and is
one of our core members

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of our on-farm food safety team.

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So we came together, Michelle

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if you'd be kind enough
to advance the slide.

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We came together prior
to COVID and developed

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a number of resources,

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which I believe were
linked in the next slide

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if I'm not mistaken

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that help people look at agritourism

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as an economic development opportunity,

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everything from how you market
to how you consider pricing

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to the very important
matters of farm safety

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and critically, critically important

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is liability management.

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And the analogy that I
often was fond of making is

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if any of you watched the Christmas story,

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the movie with Ralphie
and his little brother.

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I always had a picture of
Ralphie's little brother.

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Don't remember the poor
little guy's name but anyway

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his mom dressed them up in
layers and layers and layers

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and layers of clothing to fight the cold.

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In many ways, thank you to
my colleague, Steve Komar,

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his name was Randy for anyone interested.

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And the point there was,

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you really need to insulate
yourself against liability.

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You'll never protect or eliminate risk

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but all you can really do is try to,

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is to the extent possible
layer yourself with protections

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against liability that
could harm your farm

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or even your personal wellbeing.

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So when COVID came around, we
had a few sensitivities here.

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We'd had extensive amount of
programming in normal years

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if you will.

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But now we had a threat
that really jeopardized

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potentially our agritourism season.

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Secretary of Agriculture
in New Jersey, Doug Fisher,

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myself and others in
Extension talked to early

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in the pandemic about the essential need

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for providing food through our
direct farm markets early on.

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And we came up with a number
of practices that really guided

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the State of New Jersey

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in terms of how our operators
manage their farm markets.

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But then we started
getting into agritourism

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where people are coming onto the farms,

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yes, potentially for access to food

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but also other activities
that may not necessarily

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be directly related to purchasing of food.

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It is such an important economic activity,

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we can point the countless
growers who make upwards

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of half their income
in 18 days of the year

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between mid-September through Halloween.

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So as the depth of that
pandemic became more evident

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and it was clear that this was ongoing.

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We really saw that we had an obligation

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to try to provide some
guidance to our growers

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and guidance that would
give the State of New Jersey

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the comfort that the industry
and all of its partners

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were standing up and
prepared to help the industry

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try to remain as profitable as
possible during this pandemic

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at the same time keeping the public safe.

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So we were working with
producers to help them

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manage safety considerations,

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central to this was complying
with state directives.

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Our governor, Governor Murphy
was passing executive orders

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that limited outdoor gathering
capacities as an example.

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You have to be compliant
with executive orders

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or you'll get shut down potentially.

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Also I think the moral
and practical obligations

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of trying to keep yourself, your staff

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and visitors safe by adhering
to guidance from the CDC

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and other state and local
public health authorities.

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The guidance has changed for a while,

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masks were not required,
then they were required,

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this was required, that was required.

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Is it the science kept
emerging and changing.

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So we help try to navigate
growers to make sure

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that they were compliant with
the best possible advice.

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Now, here's the really challenging issue.

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We were very sensitive about not saying

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that these are the things you must do.

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We were even sensitive about saying

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that these are the best practices

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for engaging in agritourism
as safely as possible

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and here's why, every
operation is different.

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We were really taking it as sort of

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a performance-based approach, right?

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What Lisa's farm may best be able to do

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in terms of distancing
may be very different

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from what Michelle can do.

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So we were trying to avoid
being overly prescriptive.

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We were trying to say, this is
the best way of doing things.

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So rather what Michelle will
outline in the time to follow

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is what we called considerations.

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We're not telling you necessarily
how to do certain things.

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We can offer you resources
about cleaning and disinfecting.

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We can give you practical
guidance about laying out

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a pattern of pedestrian
flow to reduce choke points

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or try to keep densities lower.

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We can talk about things
like how you might wanna

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reduce the number of
people coming to your farm

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through advanced ticketing
or time ticketing

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but we're not gonna be prescriptive.

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We're offering you
considerations in a number

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of different areas that
you should consider

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and evaluate through your own eyes

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and perhaps other professionals
unique to your operation.

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So the key thing we
were trying to avoid is

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any pretense that there's
one way to do something

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because perhaps Lisa could
do it and Michelle could not

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but maybe Michelle had a
different way of accommodating

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a crowd or handling
safety in a different way

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that worked well for her farm.

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So Michelle, with that, Michelle Casella

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will take over and walk you through

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some of the considerations
that we were sharing

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with growers as we move
through the summer months

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into our fall agritourism season.

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And yes, I believe Carrie also linked this

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in the chat window a moment
ago but here's a repository

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of resources that are generally a value

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for helping to assess one's farm.

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And what we use here are starting points

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for when we approached COVID.

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So Michelle, if you'd be
good enough to take over,

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I think you'll speak for a little while

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and then we'll open it up
for discussion and questions.

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- Thank you, Brian and Brian was right,

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not everyone has the same management style

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or the same layout in their farm.

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So everything we tried
to do was really guidance

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and not prescriptive.

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The one thing I did wanna
say is the checklist

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that we developed that you
could find on the website

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are a little bit formatted
a little bit differently

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than this, because there's
areas where you can check off

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00:12:05,190 --> 00:12:08,070
and make comments for your own business.

255
00:12:08,070 --> 00:12:11,980
But the thing is, it's really
a self-assessment tool.

256
00:12:11,980 --> 00:12:14,330
Now you can certainly work with
your Extension professionals

257
00:12:14,330 --> 00:12:16,470
or ag service providers to get some tips

258
00:12:16,470 --> 00:12:19,300
and find some more
resources, but basically

259
00:12:19,300 --> 00:12:21,160
the checklists were meant for you

260
00:12:21,160 --> 00:12:25,340
to do your own on-farm assessment
and just use it as a tool.

261
00:12:25,340 --> 00:12:28,550
So nothing really formal,
nothing that's prescriptive

262
00:12:28,550 --> 00:12:29,930
but again something to help you

263
00:12:29,930 --> 00:12:32,040
with your own management style.

264
00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:33,510
So I'm gonna go over some of the sections

265
00:12:33,510 --> 00:12:36,870
of the checklist that we did
for COVID-19 last summer.

266
00:12:36,870 --> 00:12:38,460
Things have changed a little bit.

267
00:12:38,460 --> 00:12:41,760
I did post the current
most recent executive order

268
00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:43,970
for New Jersey because
things are changing rapidly

269
00:12:43,970 --> 00:12:46,853
as they are in your own
states about numbers,

270
00:12:48,050 --> 00:12:50,660
mask regulations, things like that

271
00:12:50,660 --> 00:12:51,720
that are related to COVID.

272
00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:54,980
So everyday things change and
we all have to have our pulse

273
00:12:54,980 --> 00:12:57,080
on those changes as business owners,

274
00:12:57,080 --> 00:13:00,020
as an Extension people to help our farmers

275
00:13:00,020 --> 00:13:01,970
to learn more and more
about what's going on.

276
00:13:01,970 --> 00:13:04,700
So again, we went through
current regulations

277
00:13:04,700 --> 00:13:06,530
at the time when we did this last summer

278
00:13:06,530 --> 00:13:09,350
but we've also been
updating current regulations

279
00:13:09,350 --> 00:13:11,707
as well as Brian mentioned
Meredith Melendez

280
00:13:11,707 --> 00:13:14,892
who is on our team with farm food safety.

281
00:13:14,892 --> 00:13:16,550
Meredith's done a great job of updating

282
00:13:16,550 --> 00:13:19,140
and putting more
information as time goes on

283
00:13:19,140 --> 00:13:21,430
related to farm regulation
and food safety.

284
00:13:21,430 --> 00:13:25,000
Not only food safety but
also some farm safety

285
00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,350
information that you
could find on our website.

286
00:13:28,380 --> 00:13:30,300
The next thing we did is we really wanted

287
00:13:30,300 --> 00:13:34,050
to encourage growers to
evaluate their signs,

288
00:13:34,050 --> 00:13:37,510
help their staff as
well as themselves learn

289
00:13:37,510 --> 00:13:40,370
about the signs and symptoms of COVID-19

290
00:13:40,370 --> 00:13:44,410
so that if someone came on to
the property or if an employee

291
00:13:44,410 --> 00:13:47,550
or family member of the
farm started feeling ill,

292
00:13:47,550 --> 00:13:50,940
we wanted to talk to
them about what do we do?

293
00:13:50,940 --> 00:13:51,960
How do we handle this?

294
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:55,240
And again, things have changed
since we've had vaccinations.

295
00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:58,010
It has been different times
with quarantine, or if you do

296
00:13:58,010 --> 00:14:01,460
or don't have the quarantine and again

297
00:14:01,460 --> 00:14:04,440
an ever evolving situation
as we know more and more

298
00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:06,010
about this disease.

299
00:14:06,010 --> 00:14:08,630
So again, we just, this
was for training purposes

300
00:14:08,630 --> 00:14:10,370
and self-evaluation.

301
00:14:10,370 --> 00:14:12,540
One thing that's been a big angst

302
00:14:12,540 --> 00:14:14,740
not only with farms having visitors

303
00:14:14,740 --> 00:14:17,220
but even other public
and entertainment venues

304
00:14:17,220 --> 00:14:21,140
having visitors is the use
of cloth face coverings.

305
00:14:21,140 --> 00:14:22,910
There's different camps out there.

306
00:14:22,910 --> 00:14:23,743
Do they work?

307
00:14:23,743 --> 00:14:24,576
Do they not work?

308
00:14:24,576 --> 00:14:26,728
Do we need them after vaccinations?

309
00:14:26,728 --> 00:14:27,561
Do we not need them?

310
00:14:27,561 --> 00:14:31,150
But again, this is something
that's in executive orders

311
00:14:31,150 --> 00:14:33,740
in your state, even though
the CDC may say that

312
00:14:34,742 --> 00:14:36,850
you don't need to wear masks outdoors.

313
00:14:36,850 --> 00:14:38,580
A lot of states continue to say

314
00:14:38,580 --> 00:14:40,850
you need to wear a mask outdoors.

315
00:14:40,850 --> 00:14:43,240
Actually, we were just,
Bill Bamka and I today

316
00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:47,010
on our team was looking at
the latest Executive Order 238

317
00:14:47,010 --> 00:14:48,630
by Governor Murphy in New Jersey.

318
00:14:48,630 --> 00:14:52,850
And it still requires
even outdoor facilities

319
00:14:52,850 --> 00:14:56,750
or outdoor events that
masks are to be worn.

320
00:14:56,750 --> 00:14:59,900
So even though some people
aren't happy about that,

321
00:14:59,900 --> 00:15:02,550
we do have to follow the regulations.

322
00:15:02,550 --> 00:15:05,120
And also it's the image that we're showing

323
00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:07,720
at our businesses for those who are still

324
00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,860
very concerned or for those
who aren't vaccinated yet

325
00:15:10,860 --> 00:15:11,960
just how we're handling this.

326
00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:15,220
So again, self-assessment
on the farm and also knowing

327
00:15:15,220 --> 00:15:18,050
what the proper regulations
are at the time.

328
00:15:18,050 --> 00:15:21,610
Cleaning and disinfection,
Meredith was really great

329
00:15:21,610 --> 00:15:24,610
about helping our team with
this because she has a lot

330
00:15:24,610 --> 00:15:28,600
of information and experience
in this with farm food safety.

331
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,160
Now you have that guy on the farm

332
00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:32,170
if you look in the right hand side there

333
00:15:32,170 --> 00:15:34,420
that guy just wants to touch the sheep.

334
00:15:34,420 --> 00:15:36,625
So Brian, that's you by the way.

335
00:15:36,625 --> 00:15:37,639
(laughs)

336
00:15:37,639 --> 00:15:40,180
And you wanna to make sure
you have hand sanitizer.

337
00:15:40,180 --> 00:15:42,940
Even without COVID-19
we had hand sanitizer

338
00:15:42,940 --> 00:15:44,240
if someone had a petting zoo

339
00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:46,720
or just to have some cleanliness

340
00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:47,980
and sanitation on the farm.

341
00:15:47,980 --> 00:15:49,810
But then when COVID-19 hit

342
00:15:49,810 --> 00:15:51,910
it was even more important
to have the cleaning

343
00:15:51,910 --> 00:15:54,370
and disinfection done on the farms.

344
00:15:54,370 --> 00:15:56,020
And again, there's some regulations

345
00:15:56,020 --> 00:15:57,620
that went along with that.

346
00:15:57,620 --> 00:15:59,790
And then signage, just
as a really important

347
00:15:59,790 --> 00:16:01,600
and something that really hit home.

348
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,070
Again before COVID very important,

349
00:16:04,070 --> 00:16:07,340
after COVID hit even more
important help people know

350
00:16:07,340 --> 00:16:08,890
where they needed to walk,

351
00:16:08,890 --> 00:16:11,510
what regulations they needed to follow

352
00:16:11,510 --> 00:16:13,750
or even what roles on your
own farm you implemented

353
00:16:13,750 --> 00:16:17,260
that were above and beyond
just for your own safety

354
00:16:17,260 --> 00:16:20,270
or for the safety of
your visitors ultimately.

355
00:16:20,270 --> 00:16:22,380
We also talked about in our checklist

356
00:16:22,380 --> 00:16:24,500
how to modify the layout
or physical barriers

357
00:16:24,500 --> 00:16:28,220
of the farm, again for safety, with COVID.

358
00:16:28,220 --> 00:16:30,870
Again, this was something even
pre-COVID that was important

359
00:16:30,870 --> 00:16:34,530
but even more so now,
especially with distancing,

360
00:16:34,530 --> 00:16:37,540
making sure people aren't
going in the same ingress

361
00:16:37,540 --> 00:16:39,490
and egress when they're
walking by each other.

362
00:16:39,490 --> 00:16:40,950
When they're coming from the parking lot

363
00:16:40,950 --> 00:16:42,450
if they've forgotten the mask

364
00:16:42,450 --> 00:16:46,360
or just the flow of traffic,
foot traffic in and out

365
00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:48,310
of the parking lot was important.

366
00:16:48,310 --> 00:16:50,660
And again, training your
employees was very important

367
00:16:50,660 --> 00:16:53,010
which we'll, we have a
section on that later.

368
00:16:53,010 --> 00:16:55,930
Not gonna talk too much
about response and liability

369
00:16:55,930 --> 00:16:58,260
because next week you're
gonna hear a lot about this

370
00:16:58,260 --> 00:17:01,483
in the next webinar but just
to glaze over it a little bit,

371
00:17:02,900 --> 00:17:04,480
with COVID it changed some things

372
00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:06,550
about what we needed to do but farm safety

373
00:17:06,550 --> 00:17:09,220
when having visitors on the
farm is of upmost importance.

374
00:17:09,220 --> 00:17:12,020
Like Brian mentioned, that
six year old little boy

375
00:17:12,020 --> 00:17:13,873
just looking for fun on the farm.

376
00:17:14,970 --> 00:17:17,450
Communications and
marketing something again,

377
00:17:17,450 --> 00:17:20,140
you would always do for your
direct marketing business

378
00:17:20,140 --> 00:17:23,680
however communications
and marketing during COVID

379
00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:24,513
was very important.

380
00:17:24,513 --> 00:17:27,140
And just having that
perception of your farm

381
00:17:27,140 --> 00:17:29,580
that you're following
all of the requirements

382
00:17:29,580 --> 00:17:32,340
and all the safety that
you could possibly do.

383
00:17:32,340 --> 00:17:36,580
Again, no matter how people
feel for or against masks

384
00:17:36,580 --> 00:17:39,490
or how they feel about the pandemic

385
00:17:39,490 --> 00:17:43,740
portraying that really
good image on Facebook

386
00:17:43,740 --> 00:17:45,920
that was a big issue in the beginning,

387
00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:49,170
making sure that your social
media, your web pages also

388
00:17:49,170 --> 00:17:50,620
that you were doing the
best thing you could

389
00:17:50,620 --> 00:17:52,100
with the pandemic.

390
00:17:52,100 --> 00:17:54,100
Can we talk about parking
and traffic a little bit

391
00:17:54,100 --> 00:17:57,840
but that was also something
that needed to be rethought

392
00:17:57,840 --> 00:18:01,100
about during the
pandemic, other than times

393
00:18:01,100 --> 00:18:04,280
when we didn't have the
pandemic to deal with.

394
00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,070
Employees, a huge one especially

395
00:18:07,070 --> 00:18:10,450
when it came to COVID-19
and training employees.

396
00:18:10,450 --> 00:18:12,950
And then also we really wanted to discuss

397
00:18:12,950 --> 00:18:15,980
with growers who was gonna be the person

398
00:18:15,980 --> 00:18:20,160
who was going to be the
incident reporting person

399
00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:22,410
or the incident confrontation person.

400
00:18:22,410 --> 00:18:25,180
If someone on the farm
was really having an issue

401
00:18:25,180 --> 00:18:27,340
with some of the rules,
it really shouldn't be

402
00:18:27,340 --> 00:18:29,330
that new employee that
just started last week.

403
00:18:29,330 --> 00:18:33,000
That may be 16 years old that
doesn't have all the answers

404
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:34,580
or necessarily have the authority.

405
00:18:34,580 --> 00:18:39,350
So again, we wanted to
make sure that was thought

406
00:18:39,350 --> 00:18:43,680
about ahead of time, there was
a plan in place and make sure

407
00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:47,060
that the employees had regular
meetings and regular updates

408
00:18:47,060 --> 00:18:49,890
and constant supervision to help get ready

409
00:18:49,890 --> 00:18:53,050
for what was coming in the
season, a very unique season.

410
00:18:53,050 --> 00:18:54,830
Many of our on farm direct marketing

411
00:18:54,830 --> 00:18:57,230
and agritourism operations
have petting zoos

412
00:18:57,230 --> 00:19:01,220
or other kinds of animal
events or displays.

413
00:19:01,220 --> 00:19:04,000
There definitely was some concern

414
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:06,900
about COVID being
transferred through animals.

415
00:19:06,900 --> 00:19:08,950
Some animals did test positive.

416
00:19:08,950 --> 00:19:10,990
We wanted to make sure
that there was safety

417
00:19:10,990 --> 00:19:13,500
between the visitors and
also safety for the animals.

418
00:19:13,500 --> 00:19:15,860
We haven't heard of
anything that's happened

419
00:19:15,860 --> 00:19:18,590
on farms that COVID
transmission with livestock

420
00:19:18,590 --> 00:19:21,330
or petting zoo animals,
but that's a good thing.

421
00:19:21,330 --> 00:19:24,090
So hopefully everything's
being handled responsibly

422
00:19:24,090 --> 00:19:26,840
and everyone's evaluating
their own situations.

423
00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:27,960
And there happened to be quite a bit

424
00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:31,080
on animal safety to think about.

425
00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:35,470
And again, there's also a CDC
guidelines for regular times

426
00:19:35,470 --> 00:19:37,290
without a pandemic to have hygiene

427
00:19:37,290 --> 00:19:38,790
when you're near animal areas.

428
00:19:39,650 --> 00:19:41,410
I'm not gonna talk about food safety much.

429
00:19:41,410 --> 00:19:43,690
Meredith can answer a lot
of questions for us later

430
00:19:43,690 --> 00:19:47,120
but also I believe we have
something on the schedule

431
00:19:47,120 --> 00:19:49,210
down the road with this
webinar series to talk

432
00:19:49,210 --> 00:19:51,920
about food safety and COVID-19.

433
00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,350
And again just some regular
things to think about

434
00:19:54,350 --> 00:19:56,750
but even more so with COVID-19.

435
00:19:56,750 --> 00:19:58,420
I wanted to go over those pretty quickly

436
00:19:58,420 --> 00:20:02,480
because we have a lot of
our team members on tonight

437
00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:04,360
actually all of our team
members that contributed

438
00:20:04,360 --> 00:20:09,360
to the checklist for
COVID-19, as well as those

439
00:20:09,700 --> 00:20:12,680
who helped contribute to
our regular checklists.

440
00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:15,180
And we wanted to bring up some discussion.

441
00:20:15,180 --> 00:20:17,280
I know Lisa, you have some questions

442
00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:20,250
that were preempted when people registered

443
00:20:20,250 --> 00:20:22,250
but we'd like to have some
open discussion tonight

444
00:20:22,250 --> 00:20:23,940
if that's possible.

445
00:20:23,940 --> 00:20:25,840
So thank you and Brian.

446
00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:28,850
- Michelle, so one thing that I didn't say

447
00:20:28,850 --> 00:20:30,870
in my earlier comments that,

448
00:20:30,870 --> 00:20:34,290
so this applies even to
right now within Extension.

449
00:20:34,290 --> 00:20:37,240
Here in New Jersey we are
starting to take steps to get back

450
00:20:37,240 --> 00:20:40,320
to in person programming
and Michelle and colleagues

451
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,020
on the line will tell
you one of the things

452
00:20:42,020 --> 00:20:46,130
that I've really asked
is to be conspicuous

453
00:20:46,130 --> 00:20:50,090
with your efforts, to
be safe and compliant.

454
00:20:50,090 --> 00:20:53,210
Be conspicuous with
your efforts to be safe

455
00:20:53,210 --> 00:20:55,280
because I'll tell you that social media

456
00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:57,760
is a cruel double-edged sword.

457
00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:01,450
I saw rate reviews about some operations

458
00:21:01,450 --> 00:21:05,560
that did an exceptional job
and I'll give a few examples

459
00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:08,430
of dealing with a
tremendous amount of fear

460
00:21:08,430 --> 00:21:10,950
and uncertainty in the
early stages of the pandemic

461
00:21:10,950 --> 00:21:14,920
before we really were
acclimated to safety practices.

462
00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:16,600
And before we had a better understanding

463
00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:20,690
of how this thing is
transmitted more readily.

464
00:21:20,690 --> 00:21:22,920
And on the other side of the coin

465
00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:26,550
we had some operations that
I'm quite familiar with

466
00:21:26,550 --> 00:21:31,460
that were really
crucified in social media.

467
00:21:31,460 --> 00:21:33,980
People weren't wearing
masks during the summer

468
00:21:33,980 --> 00:21:36,440
and honestly they lost
business and they had

469
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:38,510
to reverse course almost immediately.

470
00:21:38,510 --> 00:21:42,780
Be conspicuously compliant,
it's important in terms

471
00:21:42,780 --> 00:21:46,280
of giving the assurance of
local and state regulators.

472
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,190
It's also important because of

473
00:21:49,190 --> 00:21:51,080
visitor perception and comfort.

474
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:53,270
As I said, in terms of some
of the exceptional efforts

475
00:21:53,270 --> 00:21:55,090
I think of one operation
that my colleagues

476
00:21:55,090 --> 00:21:56,020
would be quite familiar with

477
00:21:56,020 --> 00:21:58,580
in Central Jersey,
Northern Central Jersey.

478
00:21:58,580 --> 00:22:01,320
They had everything
from personal shoppers,

479
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:03,270
They disinfected every pen

480
00:22:03,270 --> 00:22:07,000
between transactions at
the credit card with their,

481
00:22:07,000 --> 00:22:11,860
they had a very, very rigorous
disinfecting protocols,

482
00:22:11,860 --> 00:22:16,860
their business skyrocketed,
absolutely skyrocketed.

483
00:22:17,360 --> 00:22:19,710
We know a number of growers
that actually did things

484
00:22:19,710 --> 00:22:22,770
very well during the pandemic
when people were fearful

485
00:22:22,770 --> 00:22:24,540
for going into the supermarket

486
00:22:24,540 --> 00:22:29,540
and they had historical highs,
weekend highs, weekday highs.

487
00:22:30,410 --> 00:22:32,990
It was really pretty remarkable.

488
00:22:32,990 --> 00:22:36,020
So I think the industry
really stepped up a lot

489
00:22:36,020 --> 00:22:38,490
but we're not out of this mess
yet because we're going to be

490
00:22:38,490 --> 00:22:41,070
in this very funny period of transition

491
00:22:41,070 --> 00:22:44,510
where people are vaccinated
and some are getting,

492
00:22:44,510 --> 00:22:46,220
we're getting some mixed messages now

493
00:22:46,220 --> 00:22:48,890
between state direction about masks,

494
00:22:48,890 --> 00:22:52,480
if you're vaccinated and
outdoors and so forth.

495
00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:55,840
So there are gonna be
an Michelle passed over

496
00:22:55,840 --> 00:22:58,450
a point very quickly
that's really important.

497
00:22:58,450 --> 00:23:03,450
We can really envision discomfort
conflict at public venues,

498
00:23:04,620 --> 00:23:07,480
farms included as we
go through this period

499
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:10,890
of more people getting
vaccinated, having a certain level

500
00:23:10,890 --> 00:23:13,980
of comfort, not wearing a
mask, being in private settings

501
00:23:13,980 --> 00:23:15,567
and others that are
gonna look at that person

502
00:23:15,567 --> 00:23:17,310
and not know.

503
00:23:17,310 --> 00:23:20,360
So again, my personal guidance to growers

504
00:23:20,360 --> 00:23:21,860
that I'm quite friendly with

505
00:23:21,860 --> 00:23:26,270
is be conspicuous with your
efforts to still be safe.

506
00:23:26,270 --> 00:23:29,390
I think one, the evidence
over the last 14 months

507
00:23:29,390 --> 00:23:33,300
is that customers have
reacted favorably to that.

508
00:23:33,300 --> 00:23:37,650
And quite frankly, we're
still, here in New Jersey

509
00:23:37,650 --> 00:23:39,870
I can tell you our transmission
rate is now starting

510
00:23:39,870 --> 00:23:41,920
to go up again as we're opening.

511
00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:44,040
So we're gonna go through
some rocky periods.

512
00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:45,676
Michelle back to you.

513
00:23:45,676 --> 00:23:47,940
- All right, I'd just like
to open it up to discussion.

514
00:23:47,940 --> 00:23:52,540
Lisa, you have some questions
or if anyone can be unmuted

515
00:23:52,540 --> 00:23:53,943
now to answer questions.

516
00:23:55,110 --> 00:23:58,790
- I'll invite everyone to
type questions into the chat

517
00:23:58,790 --> 00:24:02,040
at any time, raise your
hand either virtually

518
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:05,740
or really raise your hand
and then you can unmute.

519
00:24:05,740 --> 00:24:07,340
In the meantime though, I'm looking

520
00:24:07,340 --> 00:24:10,800
at the registration
report where we did have

521
00:24:11,694 --> 00:24:13,030
some really good questions coming in

522
00:24:13,030 --> 00:24:14,890
from people when they registered.

523
00:24:14,890 --> 00:24:16,970
And I'm gonna ask you a question.

524
00:24:16,970 --> 00:24:20,420
I know I should start off with
something easy, a softball.

525
00:24:20,420 --> 00:24:23,640
I'm not gonna do that because
there was one question I read

526
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:27,150
and I thought I don't
know what the answer is

527
00:24:27,150 --> 00:24:29,790
and I don't know if anyone
here will know the answer

528
00:24:29,790 --> 00:24:34,790
but I'm gonna ask it and
we'll see what folks say.

529
00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:37,670
The question is, I'm
interested in learning

530
00:24:37,670 --> 00:24:41,770
if food sampling should be allowed.

531
00:24:41,770 --> 00:24:46,110
And if so, what enhanced guidance
if any should be followed.

532
00:24:46,110 --> 00:24:48,710
This is something, I mean
food sampling was something

533
00:24:48,710 --> 00:24:53,130
that was very popular
on farms before COVID

534
00:24:53,130 --> 00:24:55,833
and then it absolutely completely stopped.

535
00:24:56,670 --> 00:24:58,350
And I don't have an answer for this person

536
00:24:58,350 --> 00:24:59,720
but I'm putting it out there to see

537
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:01,190
if anybody else has an answer.

538
00:25:01,190 --> 00:25:04,050
And I'll say, I'm
throwing this to, you know

539
00:25:04,050 --> 00:25:08,680
you and your team at
Rutgers, but I know we've got

540
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:11,490
some other folks here who
are either running farms

541
00:25:11,490 --> 00:25:15,720
or for example, a UNH
food safety specialist.

542
00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,410
So other folks can feel
free to chime in as well.

543
00:25:18,410 --> 00:25:21,873
But let's start with Michelle
and the Rutgers team.

544
00:25:22,780 --> 00:25:24,530
- I'm gonna fall over to Meredith,

545
00:25:24,530 --> 00:25:25,777
she's our food safety expert.

546
00:25:25,777 --> 00:25:26,610
(laughs)

547
00:25:26,610 --> 00:25:27,443
Thanks Meredith.

548
00:25:27,443 --> 00:25:31,650
- Yeah, so this was a question
that came up early on too

549
00:25:31,650 --> 00:25:35,130
in the pandemic especially
from our FCHS Department

550
00:25:35,130 --> 00:25:37,810
here at Rutgers because
food sampling was so much

551
00:25:37,810 --> 00:25:40,200
of the work that they did.

552
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:42,200
And so that was, I think,
one of the first things

553
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,890
that affected it in terms
of Extension educators

554
00:25:45,890 --> 00:25:49,960
and being able to get
their clients, clientele,

555
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,650
people that are educating to sample.

556
00:25:52,650 --> 00:25:56,940
But I mean, in New Jersey,
they're allowing buffets again

557
00:25:56,940 --> 00:25:58,617
but companies like Wegmans are saying,

558
00:25:58,617 --> 00:26:01,020
"We're no longer gonna have our buffet."

559
00:26:01,020 --> 00:26:03,310
And so it's different than sampling

560
00:26:03,310 --> 00:26:05,523
but it's open air food.

561
00:26:06,500 --> 00:26:10,028
And I don't think the state,
Brian, have you seen anything?

562
00:26:10,028 --> 00:26:12,030
I don't think the state has addressed that

563
00:26:12,030 --> 00:26:14,233
in any of the executive orders.

564
00:26:15,100 --> 00:26:17,830
- Not that I'm aware of
because to your point

565
00:26:17,830 --> 00:26:19,570
we're getting these same questions now

566
00:26:19,570 --> 00:26:22,800
as we're starting to move
back to in person programming

567
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:24,340
and I don't see any guidance

568
00:26:24,340 --> 00:26:27,470
from the state on that
route in this regard.

569
00:26:27,470 --> 00:26:29,150
- Yeah, it might be a farmer's market

570
00:26:29,150 --> 00:26:32,790
by farmer's market type
decision that might lead the way

571
00:26:32,790 --> 00:26:35,150
in terms of discussion with that.

572
00:26:35,150 --> 00:26:37,727
But that's a great question.

573
00:26:37,727 --> 00:26:39,850
And yeah, it'll be interesting.

574
00:26:39,850 --> 00:26:41,840
I wonder if people's attitude

575
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,160
towards sampling is gonna change.

576
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,790
I guess Costco would be
the leader in that, right?

577
00:26:46,790 --> 00:26:49,680
We need to do some polling
on Costco customers

578
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:53,820
and whether they they're
feeling the samples or not.

579
00:26:53,820 --> 00:26:56,323
- So Meredith is it fair
to say that there's,

580
00:26:57,593 --> 00:26:59,109
oh, I'm sorry, Rick could
chime in or did you wanna?

581
00:26:59,109 --> 00:27:02,440
- [Rick] Go ahead, I was
gonna just mention one thing

582
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:03,500
but go ahead.

583
00:27:03,500 --> 00:27:05,140
- No, go ahead, Rick,
I'll hold the thought.

584
00:27:05,140 --> 00:27:08,090
- My thought was sampling is

585
00:27:08,090 --> 00:27:11,030
and I don't know if it's
also a state directive here

586
00:27:11,030 --> 00:27:16,030
in New Jersey or if it is a
individual business decision

587
00:27:17,340 --> 00:27:22,340
but most retailers that
had self-packaging,

588
00:27:22,340 --> 00:27:26,340
self-selection of both
produce and baked goods,

589
00:27:26,340 --> 00:27:30,000
you can't get the, you can't
go in and grab a donut anymore

590
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:32,140
without it being pre-packaged.

591
00:27:32,140 --> 00:27:37,140
And in most cases it's not
pre-packaged individually,

592
00:27:37,270 --> 00:27:39,530
it's wrapped up with three or four others.

593
00:27:39,530 --> 00:27:43,230
So on one hand, you're
selling three, instead of one,

594
00:27:43,230 --> 00:27:46,110
on the other hand, you've
got to do that packaging,

595
00:27:46,110 --> 00:27:48,980
so is in the same vein as sampling.

596
00:27:48,980 --> 00:27:52,060
You're not having the public reaching in

597
00:27:52,060 --> 00:27:53,720
and grabbing things.

598
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:55,560
- Yeah, Pete made a comment too, right?

599
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,380
If somebody's sampling food in your market

600
00:27:58,380 --> 00:28:00,710
or on your farm they're
taking their mask down.

601
00:28:00,710 --> 00:28:02,930
And so that's a good point too.

602
00:28:02,930 --> 00:28:05,810
It's gonna really depend on
the operations comfort level

603
00:28:05,810 --> 00:28:08,400
with people in masking.

604
00:28:08,400 --> 00:28:11,080
- One of the challenges is
that we try to provide advice

605
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:12,950
that's based on science.

606
00:28:12,950 --> 00:28:15,883
And meanwhile, this is
such an emotional issue.

607
00:28:16,738 --> 00:28:19,063
It's a human reaction to fear.

608
00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:23,460
So we also have the consumer
perception to deal with.

609
00:28:23,460 --> 00:28:27,850
So right now I see Ashley
makes an interesting comment

610
00:28:27,850 --> 00:28:31,000
that she doesn't miss it in her operation

611
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,810
but they're doing more effort to add signs

612
00:28:34,810 --> 00:28:36,370
in terms of product descriptions

613
00:28:36,370 --> 00:28:40,100
and stationing people to help
staff help answer questions.

614
00:28:40,100 --> 00:28:43,430
So one of the bits of advice
that we have is interesting.

615
00:28:43,430 --> 00:28:46,860
Meredith and some of her
colleagues very early on

616
00:28:46,860 --> 00:28:50,670
in far markets and then of
course here with agritourism

617
00:28:50,670 --> 00:28:54,840
were really up to the
minute with CDC guidance

618
00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:58,173
on cleaning, disinfecting, sanitizing.

619
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:02,250
At that early stage, we
didn't know how transmissible

620
00:29:02,250 --> 00:29:05,410
the virus was through
contact with surfaces.

621
00:29:05,410 --> 00:29:08,160
But even now even if
the science is starting

622
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:12,470
to suggest Meredith and please
correct me if you disagree

623
00:29:12,470 --> 00:29:14,600
but the science is starting to point to

624
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:16,650
that there's less risk of transmission

625
00:29:16,650 --> 00:29:18,880
through certain surfaces

626
00:29:18,880 --> 00:29:21,350
but there's still a perception issue.

627
00:29:21,350 --> 00:29:23,310
And I saw folks, that
was very interesting,

628
00:29:23,310 --> 00:29:26,490
I was in a retail environment recently

629
00:29:26,490 --> 00:29:31,220
where people were offering
chocolate candies as samplers.

630
00:29:31,220 --> 00:29:33,490
And I was just sort of
sitting there watching,

631
00:29:33,490 --> 00:29:35,480
the majority of people declined.

632
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:37,120
So I think it's one of these things

633
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,220
where I don't wanna comment on the risk

634
00:29:39,220 --> 00:29:40,630
because Meredith is the expert

635
00:29:40,630 --> 00:29:43,660
and again, this is still
evolving science as far

636
00:29:43,660 --> 00:29:47,600
as I'm concerned, but
again, having people come

637
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,550
into contact with one
another to offer a sample

638
00:29:50,550 --> 00:29:54,720
to somebody, you're
approaching them as an example.

639
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:59,080
If you are doing it, I still
would maintain that perception,

640
00:30:00,220 --> 00:30:02,490
customer comfort, staff
comfort would probably

641
00:30:02,490 --> 00:30:06,460
suggest eliminating or minimizing
to every feasible extent

642
00:30:06,460 --> 00:30:09,400
any touching of common surfaces, right?

643
00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:12,090
Because we're having this
same discussion Meredith again

644
00:30:12,090 --> 00:30:13,490
with some of our FCHS,

645
00:30:13,490 --> 00:30:16,120
our family and community
health science educators

646
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,160
that are starting to get
back into demonstrations

647
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:21,850
and our guidance with an
Extension to our colleagues,

648
00:30:21,850 --> 00:30:25,903
minimize common contact, try
to have a self-contained,

649
00:30:27,150 --> 00:30:30,110
food options is possible pre-packaged

650
00:30:30,110 --> 00:30:33,150
or something where people
aren't reaching in and grabbing,

651
00:30:33,150 --> 00:30:35,170
if you will from a common source.

652
00:30:35,170 --> 00:30:36,387
I don't think there's any ready answer.

653
00:30:36,387 --> 00:30:39,223
And I don't think Meredith
you're gonna see anything

654
00:30:40,254 --> 00:30:41,940
in state direction here in New Jersey.

655
00:30:41,940 --> 00:30:43,730
I don't know about elsewhere.

656
00:30:43,730 --> 00:30:45,080
- Well, I think this two lens

657
00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:47,500
to the uniqueness of agritourism

658
00:30:47,500 --> 00:30:51,010
and agritourism operators
communicate so much

659
00:30:51,010 --> 00:30:52,490
with your customers, right?

660
00:30:52,490 --> 00:30:54,920
They're gonna tell you what
they're comfortable with

661
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:56,020
or you could ask them, right?

662
00:30:56,020 --> 00:30:59,230
I know Ashley you're always
talking to your customers

663
00:30:59,230 --> 00:31:01,790
and you know what their
comfort level is with things.

664
00:31:01,790 --> 00:31:03,070
And I think that's an advantage

665
00:31:03,070 --> 00:31:06,530
to agritourism is 'cause
you're their farm, right?

666
00:31:06,530 --> 00:31:08,318
You're their farmer.

667
00:31:08,318 --> 00:31:10,820
And so get as much information as you can

668
00:31:10,820 --> 00:31:12,680
from a pool of your customers to know

669
00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:15,736
what direction they want you to go in.

670
00:31:15,736 --> 00:31:17,190
- Brian, Bill Bamka here.

671
00:31:17,190 --> 00:31:18,830
The one thing I was gonna remember where

672
00:31:18,830 --> 00:31:20,180
every time we talked with agritourism,

673
00:31:20,180 --> 00:31:21,960
we always tell everybody to also remember

674
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:23,760
run things past your insurance agent

675
00:31:24,850 --> 00:31:27,690
because they cover the
wealth of things also,

676
00:31:27,690 --> 00:31:30,330
even though something may
be okay with regulations

677
00:31:30,330 --> 00:31:32,264
sometimes they don't have a comfort level

678
00:31:32,264 --> 00:31:33,560
of certain practices.

679
00:31:33,560 --> 00:31:35,790
- And Bill, raises a great question, Lisa

680
00:31:35,790 --> 00:31:38,590
because that was a question
I saw in the Excel sheet

681
00:31:38,590 --> 00:31:42,090
a question about liability and insurance

682
00:31:42,090 --> 00:31:43,870
and I think the general advice, Lisa

683
00:31:43,870 --> 00:31:44,960
and one of your colleagues

684
00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:47,840
when I was visiting with you
for a program you organized up

685
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:51,110
in Rutland, I remember
pretty distinctly a sidebar

686
00:31:51,110 --> 00:31:53,160
conversation with an insurance agent,

687
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:55,330
quite familiar with agriculture.

688
00:31:55,330 --> 00:31:59,120
This is one of those things
where it's a risk profile

689
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:00,660
that they're evaluating.

690
00:32:00,660 --> 00:32:03,450
And one of the concerns that
we've shared with growers

691
00:32:03,450 --> 00:32:04,667
I've had a few people tell me,

692
00:32:04,667 --> 00:32:08,157
"Well, you know I might have
10,000 people visit the farm,

693
00:32:08,157 --> 00:32:10,977
"but I only tell my insurance guy 1,000

694
00:32:10,977 --> 00:32:12,497
"or I'm not gonna declare everything

695
00:32:12,497 --> 00:32:15,370
"that I'm doing because
my premiums will go up."

696
00:32:15,370 --> 00:32:19,740
That might be true, but
here's also a truism.

697
00:32:19,740 --> 00:32:22,440
If something happens that
you don't have declared

698
00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:26,750
to your insurance provider,
you will not be covered.

699
00:32:26,750 --> 00:32:29,490
So I think having a very
open and honest discussion

700
00:32:29,490 --> 00:32:32,200
with your insurance provider is important.

701
00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:34,630
It's sort of in my view, if I may

702
00:32:34,630 --> 00:32:36,950
a penny wise pound foolish decision,

703
00:32:36,950 --> 00:32:39,410
you might save a little on
your premium by if you will,

704
00:32:39,410 --> 00:32:41,370
not revealing everything.

705
00:32:41,370 --> 00:32:44,350
But boy if something adverse happens

706
00:32:44,350 --> 00:32:47,530
you'll also find yourself
conceivably without coverage.

707
00:32:47,530 --> 00:32:51,370
So I think Bill Bamka's advice
is very, very important.

708
00:32:51,370 --> 00:32:54,890
Seek guidance from your professionals

709
00:32:54,890 --> 00:32:56,373
in this case, insurance.

710
00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,380
- That's a great point, Brian
and I saw Ashley's hand up.

711
00:33:00,380 --> 00:33:02,740
Ashley, did you wanna chime in?

712
00:33:02,740 --> 00:33:05,050
- Oh, I was just gonna
share about sampling.

713
00:33:05,050 --> 00:33:07,913
I feel like it's a mixed
bag with our customers.

714
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:11,360
I feel like everyone at
this point has the culture

715
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,560
of not sampling and not
coming in contact or touching.

716
00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:16,340
So I feel like the people who are inclined

717
00:33:16,340 --> 00:33:19,250
to sample are okay with not doing it.

718
00:33:19,250 --> 00:33:21,980
I think ultimately what
they are really looking for

719
00:33:21,980 --> 00:33:24,770
is there's this taste,
can you explain and say

720
00:33:24,770 --> 00:33:25,980
how do you use it?

721
00:33:25,980 --> 00:33:29,510
And really providing your
employees as you know,

722
00:33:29,510 --> 00:33:31,743
a segue into that is a really great idea.

723
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,110
And again, if you were to
offer it and have it out,

724
00:33:35,110 --> 00:33:37,410
you're gonna have so many
people that are going to judge

725
00:33:37,410 --> 00:33:40,070
and are going to post negative comments

726
00:33:40,070 --> 00:33:42,850
on social media, Google
reviews, things like that.

727
00:33:42,850 --> 00:33:44,770
So I just think when you
have the option to do one

728
00:33:44,770 --> 00:33:49,090
of the two, you really should
err on the side of caution

729
00:33:49,090 --> 00:33:50,830
for that perception.

730
00:33:50,830 --> 00:33:52,300
- That's a great point, Ashley.

731
00:33:52,300 --> 00:33:54,100
And would you, for those
of us who don't know you

732
00:33:54,100 --> 00:33:56,090
will you just quickly introduce yourself,

733
00:33:56,090 --> 00:34:00,210
let us know where you are
and what your farm does.

734
00:34:00,210 --> 00:34:03,470
- Sure, my name is Ashley,
I'm a farmer and manager

735
00:34:03,470 --> 00:34:05,980
at Eastmont Orchards in
Colts Neck, New Jersey.

736
00:34:05,980 --> 00:34:09,740
We are exclusively pick your
own for apples and peaches.

737
00:34:09,740 --> 00:34:13,010
We've run from mid July
to the end of October.

738
00:34:13,010 --> 00:34:17,320
We've just started to attempt
hay rides, things like that.

739
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:20,210
But for the most part it's
explicitly pick your own.

740
00:34:20,210 --> 00:34:21,120
- That's great.

741
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:23,740
Well, yeah, thank you for sharing because

742
00:34:23,740 --> 00:34:28,600
we've got sort of the
kind of the educational,

743
00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:31,540
Extension view but it's
also really good to hear

744
00:34:31,540 --> 00:34:34,060
from a farmer who's in
the field and working

745
00:34:34,060 --> 00:34:36,100
with the customers and
knowing what customers

746
00:34:36,100 --> 00:34:38,530
are thinking and asking.

747
00:34:38,530 --> 00:34:42,090
We've got a similar question
from Rebecca Lindenmeyr.

748
00:34:42,970 --> 00:34:44,067
She wrote in chat,

749
00:34:44,067 --> 00:34:47,090
"I had a similar question
to the food sampling.

750
00:34:47,090 --> 00:34:50,540
We are a steed to soap
farm and make lotions.

751
00:34:50,540 --> 00:34:53,170
And we discontinued all sampling

752
00:34:53,170 --> 00:34:57,140
and are wondering if we could
and should re-introduce it.

753
00:34:57,140 --> 00:35:02,140
So probably a lot of the
same comments are true here

754
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:04,200
but it is a little different when it's a

755
00:35:05,060 --> 00:35:06,670
kind of a hand lotion as opposed

756
00:35:06,670 --> 00:35:10,010
to something that you actually
have to take your mask off

757
00:35:10,010 --> 00:35:13,940
and ingest so thoughts there?

758
00:35:13,940 --> 00:35:15,740
- Hi Lisa, it's Michelle again.

759
00:35:15,740 --> 00:35:20,450
One thing I've seen is just
because we've had to move

760
00:35:20,450 --> 00:35:24,310
towards single serve meals
for different events.

761
00:35:24,310 --> 00:35:27,510
I've also seen single
serve samples like that.

762
00:35:27,510 --> 00:35:30,140
So maybe taking a small cup with the lid,

763
00:35:30,140 --> 00:35:32,730
putting a sample on it
so that different people

764
00:35:32,730 --> 00:35:35,290
aren't touching the same dispenser.

765
00:35:35,290 --> 00:35:40,290
That's another way to get
around sampling for even food.

766
00:35:40,350 --> 00:35:42,600
It's something they can
take along with them

767
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:43,620
it's a little more expense,

768
00:35:43,620 --> 00:35:45,010
a little more time to put together

769
00:35:45,010 --> 00:35:48,290
but just like Meredith
and Ashley have said

770
00:35:48,290 --> 00:35:50,900
I think it goes a long
way with public perception

771
00:35:50,900 --> 00:35:53,710
and you still wanna provide
some of those samples.

772
00:35:53,710 --> 00:35:55,100
It helps sell your product definitely

773
00:35:55,100 --> 00:35:57,197
but just getting around a safer way.

774
00:35:57,197 --> 00:36:00,640
And even if it's not
scientifically proven to be safe

775
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,340
or just a perception way of being safer

776
00:36:03,340 --> 00:36:05,230
to package the samples.

777
00:36:05,230 --> 00:36:09,560
- Yeah and I had taken a look
at the CDC language around

778
00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:13,280
cleaning and disinfection of
those high touch surfaces.

779
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,500
And it was interesting, I
don't have a copy of what

780
00:36:16,500 --> 00:36:21,150
it used to be but it's
saying to regularly clean

781
00:36:21,150 --> 00:36:24,230
and disinfect high touch
surfaces at least once a day.

782
00:36:24,230 --> 00:36:26,360
And to my memory, that's very different

783
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:28,940
than what we were
talking about a year ago.

784
00:36:28,940 --> 00:36:33,680
So but like people's
perception and comfort level is

785
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:36,350
probably not quite there yet.

786
00:36:36,350 --> 00:36:38,580
- And Brian and I were
talking actually this morning

787
00:36:38,580 --> 00:36:40,620
that we've learned so much more

788
00:36:40,620 --> 00:36:42,680
about the disease over the last year.

789
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:44,360
However, it's still out there.

790
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,930
Our positivity rates are pretty
high, still in New Jersey.

791
00:36:46,930 --> 00:36:48,700
And I gave Brian an example.

792
00:36:48,700 --> 00:36:52,650
I looked in our county, our
health department recorded

793
00:36:52,650 --> 00:36:57,250
67 positive cases last Friday,
back in August and September

794
00:36:57,250 --> 00:37:00,530
we might have eight to
12 positive cases a day,

795
00:37:00,530 --> 00:37:02,310
however we're reopening everything.

796
00:37:02,310 --> 00:37:03,750
So why is that?

797
00:37:03,750 --> 00:37:06,350
'Cause we have people that are vaccinated.

798
00:37:06,350 --> 00:37:08,900
We have better ways of
treating the disease.

799
00:37:08,900 --> 00:37:12,820
I think people are more in
tune with what needs to be done

800
00:37:12,820 --> 00:37:16,290
but we have to realize this
virus isn't going away.

801
00:37:16,290 --> 00:37:20,540
There's mutations of it, they
call them different strains.

802
00:37:20,540 --> 00:37:22,600
So we have to really
learn to live with this

803
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:24,540
but learning in a different way

804
00:37:24,540 --> 00:37:26,720
and we've called it the
term the new normal.

805
00:37:26,720 --> 00:37:29,890
So when we have people on the farm,

806
00:37:29,890 --> 00:37:32,910
it's up to us to make sure we
provide that safe environment.

807
00:37:32,910 --> 00:37:37,160
And many of you've probably
seen the high powered actors

808
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,460
and music hosts that have had a commercial

809
00:37:40,460 --> 00:37:42,260
that they're helping to promote,

810
00:37:42,260 --> 00:37:45,110
I forget the exact term, maybe
somebody can help remember

811
00:37:45,110 --> 00:37:47,600
but there's a certification for businesses

812
00:37:47,600 --> 00:37:51,280
that are doing everything
they can to protect people

813
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:52,830
from COVID, I forget the name.

814
00:37:52,830 --> 00:37:54,680
It's a symbol that they put on the door.

815
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:57,590
So when people are walking
in, I don't think any of us

816
00:37:57,590 --> 00:38:00,060
are gonna pay that expense for a farm

817
00:38:00,060 --> 00:38:02,600
especially being an
outdoor venue to have that.

818
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:05,590
But again, the perception
is everything, Brian.

819
00:38:05,590 --> 00:38:09,690
- Yeah, we haven't given
Rebecca a very satisfying answer

820
00:38:09,690 --> 00:38:12,750
I know because I don't think there is one

821
00:38:12,750 --> 00:38:16,820
but I was having a conversation
with a grower very recently

822
00:38:16,820 --> 00:38:21,820
and actually Carol in the chat
window basically summarized

823
00:38:21,830 --> 00:38:23,730
that discussion in many ways.

824
00:38:23,730 --> 00:38:27,270
Carol notes that her operation typically

825
00:38:27,270 --> 00:38:29,833
doesn't allow customers
to touch the sample.

826
00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:33,170
They serve them in individual servings.

827
00:38:33,170 --> 00:38:37,520
Rebecca, the inquiry that I
got from somebody I'm friends

828
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:40,130
with the conversation really culminated

829
00:38:40,130 --> 00:38:41,410
with this person decided

830
00:38:41,410 --> 00:38:43,660
that they would be giving out samples.

831
00:38:43,660 --> 00:38:48,660
And in this instance, they were
concerned about their staff.

832
00:38:50,490 --> 00:38:54,300
So they were very purposefully
selecting somebody

833
00:38:54,300 --> 00:38:57,230
who had a comfort level
in approaching customers

834
00:38:57,230 --> 00:39:00,170
that happened to be vaccinated

835
00:39:00,170 --> 00:39:02,900
so maybe that contributed
to the comfort level

836
00:39:02,900 --> 00:39:06,890
but they would be distributing samples.

837
00:39:06,890 --> 00:39:11,590
I believe one of them
was something topical.

838
00:39:11,590 --> 00:39:14,810
So rather than again, somebody
having a common surface

839
00:39:14,810 --> 00:39:16,470
that multiple people are touching,

840
00:39:16,470 --> 00:39:19,540
only the staff member would
distribute in that case

841
00:39:19,540 --> 00:39:23,630
I think it was a lotion or a
fragrance or some such thing.

842
00:39:23,630 --> 00:39:25,960
So I think there are two just
trying to minimize the amount

843
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:28,860
of common contacts, even
with what Meredith said,

844
00:39:28,860 --> 00:39:32,240
the CDC guidance has
gotten a lot more liberal

845
00:39:32,240 --> 00:39:35,140
with respect to cleaning between uses is

846
00:39:35,140 --> 00:39:36,290
I didn't realize Meredith

847
00:39:36,290 --> 00:39:38,520
that the advice now is cleaning daily.

848
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,020
So again, I think there is no right answer

849
00:39:41,020 --> 00:39:43,150
but I think it's an optics issue.

850
00:39:43,150 --> 00:39:46,330
And I think it's something
where you would need to consider

851
00:39:46,330 --> 00:39:49,070
and evaluate the comfort
level of your staff

852
00:39:49,070 --> 00:39:52,470
who would be involved with
engaging customers as well.

853
00:39:52,470 --> 00:39:53,403
- Great point.

854
00:39:54,238 --> 00:39:55,960
- I was gonna say those
surface guidelines,

855
00:39:55,960 --> 00:40:00,200
again, individual stores,
even in the same chain store

856
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,970
you can go into one store
and there'll be wiping

857
00:40:02,970 --> 00:40:06,030
down the surface between every customer.

858
00:40:06,030 --> 00:40:08,280
You go to the next store, down the road

859
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,050
and it may be every third customer

860
00:40:11,050 --> 00:40:14,740
and another one you don't
see them wiping out at all.

861
00:40:14,740 --> 00:40:18,930
So it's a mixed bag out there.

862
00:40:18,930 --> 00:40:22,450
- I know Stuart Farnham,
who is an insurance agent

863
00:40:22,450 --> 00:40:23,710
wanted to chime in,

864
00:40:23,710 --> 00:40:27,490
Stuart do you wanna umnmute
and join the conversation

865
00:40:28,830 --> 00:40:30,820
- [Stuart] Oh, sorry, I
don't have my video working

866
00:40:30,820 --> 00:40:35,710
but I just wanted to comment
on something Brian said

867
00:40:35,710 --> 00:40:40,110
about being honest with
your insurance agent.

868
00:40:40,110 --> 00:40:43,010
It's hard enough to get the policy right

869
00:40:43,010 --> 00:40:45,180
when you know all the facts.

870
00:40:45,180 --> 00:40:49,070
So when people are withholding
and, or not telling you

871
00:40:49,070 --> 00:40:51,793
the full truth, it's impossible.

872
00:40:52,668 --> 00:40:53,520
(chuckles)

873
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:58,520
So I thank Brian for
bringing that whole point up.

874
00:40:59,230 --> 00:41:04,230
I tried a friend, all of the farms that

875
00:41:04,730 --> 00:41:09,730
I have insured so that I
can see what's going on.

876
00:41:10,610 --> 00:41:14,016
And if they're doing something new,

877
00:41:14,016 --> 00:41:16,643
I can poke them from
the other side and say,

878
00:41:17,940 --> 00:41:20,860
should we look at something
different for you?

879
00:41:20,860 --> 00:41:24,880
So it isn't the first
thing most people think of

880
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:28,390
is call their insurance agent
for something different.

881
00:41:28,390 --> 00:41:30,190
The other thing was on the sampling.

882
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,280
If there is a mask requirement,

883
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:37,103
you have to take your mask off to eat it.

884
00:41:37,103 --> 00:41:41,720
So you're encouraging people
to take their mask off

885
00:41:41,720 --> 00:41:43,610
to eat the sample to begin with.

886
00:41:43,610 --> 00:41:45,880
So you're contradicting

887
00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,360
your own safety precautions by doing so.

888
00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:52,920
So the individual servings

889
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:56,420
and they can take it on their
way is a good idea, I think.

890
00:41:56,420 --> 00:41:57,253
- Thanks, Stuart.

891
00:41:57,253 --> 00:42:00,670
And I'll mention that
coming up, not next Tuesday

892
00:42:00,670 --> 00:42:02,730
but the following Tuesday

893
00:42:02,730 --> 00:42:07,370
we are having a session
specifically on liability, insurance

894
00:42:07,370 --> 00:42:11,210
and coverage and Stuart will be available.

895
00:42:11,210 --> 00:42:14,570
So save up your liability
insurance questions

896
00:42:14,570 --> 00:42:19,120
and you can throw them off
Stuart's way for that session.

897
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:21,080
He warned me he may not
always have the answers

898
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:22,960
but he'll give it a try.

899
00:42:22,960 --> 00:42:27,760
- Janet's comment in the chat
box is a great suggestion

900
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:30,450
on how they deal with that sampling issue

901
00:42:30,450 --> 00:42:33,433
at their farmer's market in Montpelier.

902
00:42:34,460 --> 00:42:36,790
- Do you wanna just in case
not everyone's reading the chat

903
00:42:36,790 --> 00:42:38,450
do you want to read it off?

904
00:42:38,450 --> 00:42:40,397
- It says," At Montpelier Farmer's Market

905
00:42:40,397 --> 00:42:42,047
"you can now offer sample

906
00:42:42,047 --> 00:42:45,957
"but it must be taken to a
designated picnic table to eat.

907
00:42:45,957 --> 00:42:49,647
"No food may be eaten while
walking through the market.

908
00:42:49,647 --> 00:42:51,187
"This allows it all to be away

909
00:42:51,187 --> 00:42:53,737
"from those eating and removing masks

910
00:42:53,737 --> 00:42:56,890
"if they choose not to
be at the picnic table."

911
00:42:56,890 --> 00:42:58,670
- Thanks for reading that Rick.

912
00:42:58,670 --> 00:43:01,040
One question I had from
a local farm market

913
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:04,150
here in New Jersey last week
even though they realized

914
00:43:04,150 --> 00:43:07,470
the CDC is now saying if
you can stay six feet apart

915
00:43:07,470 --> 00:43:09,460
outdoors masks don't need to be worn.

916
00:43:09,460 --> 00:43:12,560
However, our state
regulations still says masks

917
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:14,620
needed to be worn outdoors

918
00:43:14,620 --> 00:43:18,000
but one of the questions
that was posed to me

919
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:20,310
and I checked with our
local health department.

920
00:43:20,310 --> 00:43:23,000
What constitutes outdoors?

921
00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:25,540
If you have a farm market
building that has roll-up

922
00:43:25,540 --> 00:43:28,440
garage doors and an open door in the back

923
00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:31,150
is that considered an indoor area?

924
00:43:31,150 --> 00:43:34,580
And the answer I had from
our health department

925
00:43:34,580 --> 00:43:37,030
is if there's at least one wall

926
00:43:37,030 --> 00:43:41,510
on a quote, building that
gets considered indoors.

927
00:43:41,510 --> 00:43:44,030
So even if you had a tent,
but still had a back wall

928
00:43:44,030 --> 00:43:46,600
on the tent, they were
considering that indoors.

929
00:43:46,600 --> 00:43:48,680
So I don't know how
every health department

930
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:53,680
or every authority is going
to interpret what is indoors

931
00:43:54,030 --> 00:43:54,950
and what is outdoors.

932
00:43:54,950 --> 00:43:56,940
But here in our local health department

933
00:43:56,940 --> 00:43:59,230
in the county, anything that had at least

934
00:43:59,230 --> 00:44:01,320
one wall was considered an indoor area.

935
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:04,230
So it's always good to check
with your local authorities.

936
00:44:04,230 --> 00:44:07,470
And then again perception is
everything with your customers.

937
00:44:07,470 --> 00:44:10,260
- Those health authorities
must have a fit when they go

938
00:44:10,260 --> 00:44:15,010
into the cities and see the
new outdoor dining facilities

939
00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:18,650
built in front of every
restaurant that have walls

940
00:44:18,650 --> 00:44:21,500
on three out of four sides.

941
00:44:21,500 --> 00:44:24,160
- Again, Rick it's
interpretation and perception.

942
00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:27,960
- Yep, so I'm surprised
it hasn't come up here

943
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:32,260
this evening yet because I
would say I probably had no less

944
00:44:32,260 --> 00:44:34,390
than 10 conversations already this week

945
00:44:34,390 --> 00:44:36,470
about this here in New Jersey.

946
00:44:36,470 --> 00:44:39,730
Right now, New Jersey is
in the process of lifting

947
00:44:39,730 --> 00:44:42,560
pretty substantially a lot of
the executive order limits.

948
00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:46,870
So for example folks who were
in New Jersey two months ago

949
00:44:46,870 --> 00:44:49,890
we had an outdoor gathering
limit of about 25.

950
00:44:49,890 --> 00:44:54,110
It quickly went up to 50, it
was at 200 for a little while.

951
00:44:54,110 --> 00:44:58,020
Just this past Friday, I believe it was,

952
00:44:58,020 --> 00:44:59,920
I believe it went to 500.

953
00:44:59,920 --> 00:45:01,450
And if my memory serves,

954
00:45:01,450 --> 00:45:04,150
I think it's the 17th or the 19th of May,

955
00:45:04,150 --> 00:45:05,420
the Governor anticipates

956
00:45:05,420 --> 00:45:08,940
lifting the outdoor gathering limit.

957
00:45:08,940 --> 00:45:13,850
So last fall, that was a
really challenging situation

958
00:45:13,850 --> 00:45:16,260
for some of our bigger
destination operations

959
00:45:16,260 --> 00:45:19,730
which had a sensibly
a limit of 500 people.

960
00:45:19,730 --> 00:45:21,350
Well, what does that mean?

961
00:45:21,350 --> 00:45:24,840
If you have a 500 acre farm
versus a five acre farm,

962
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:27,040
500 people look decidedly different,

963
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:29,410
it's a decidedly different density.

964
00:45:29,410 --> 00:45:32,210
So that was a challenge last year.

965
00:45:32,210 --> 00:45:35,450
Now Michelle said, or Rick or both

966
00:45:35,450 --> 00:45:36,630
said something very important.

967
00:45:36,630 --> 00:45:39,870
So even if the outdoor
gathering limits are suspended,

968
00:45:39,870 --> 00:45:42,860
masking at the time
being here in New Jersey

969
00:45:42,860 --> 00:45:44,850
and six foot distancing

970
00:45:44,850 --> 00:45:47,980
for the time being here in New
Jersey are still in effect.

971
00:45:47,980 --> 00:45:51,670
So one of the challenges that
I think some of our growers

972
00:45:51,670 --> 00:45:54,000
are starting to concern themselves with

973
00:45:54,000 --> 00:45:58,660
is how do you balance the
expectation of the consumer,

974
00:45:58,660 --> 00:46:00,727
the visitor that basically,

975
00:46:00,727 --> 00:46:04,220
"Hey, no outdoor gathering limits."

976
00:46:04,220 --> 00:46:07,670
Well, but there is a
distancing requirement.

977
00:46:07,670 --> 00:46:11,520
So a number of growers, a
few of the growers I spoke

978
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:13,790
to this week are still wondering

979
00:46:13,790 --> 00:46:16,540
should they do advanced ticketing

980
00:46:16,540 --> 00:46:18,770
so that they can actually
control populations?

981
00:46:18,770 --> 00:46:20,550
Because I think what
they're really concerned

982
00:46:20,550 --> 00:46:23,280
about on one hand, it's
wonderful for business

983
00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:26,390
when you have a surge
of people at the gate

984
00:46:26,390 --> 00:46:28,400
but again they need to be mindful

985
00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:30,860
of their ability to
maintain proper distancing

986
00:46:30,860 --> 00:46:32,700
and so forth on the farm.

987
00:46:32,700 --> 00:46:35,050
So I don't know how folks are
thinking about this right now

988
00:46:35,050 --> 00:46:36,603
but it's a real consideration,

989
00:46:37,700 --> 00:46:39,670
Ashley and some of the
others that I recognize

990
00:46:39,670 --> 00:46:42,110
from down here in New Jersey

991
00:46:42,110 --> 00:46:44,440
I think that's gonna
be a challenge for us.

992
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:48,480
So again, you may very
well still consider things

993
00:46:48,480 --> 00:46:51,720
like time ticketing, advanced ticketing

994
00:46:51,720 --> 00:46:55,280
but I would say that the
challenge that you will face

995
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:58,080
and we face it in Extension
because we're here to serve you.

996
00:46:58,080 --> 00:47:00,580
And we don't have all
the answers like Stuart

997
00:47:00,580 --> 00:47:05,580
claimed earlier is that it's
important to set expectations.

998
00:47:06,420 --> 00:47:08,530
And that's something Michelle
said in her introductory

999
00:47:08,530 --> 00:47:11,930
remarks where having
very good communication

1000
00:47:11,930 --> 00:47:14,670
on your websites, social
media, about expectations

1001
00:47:14,670 --> 00:47:18,800
whether it be masking
or maintaining distance.

1002
00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:22,260
And again, it might be also
an opportunity to message

1003
00:47:22,260 --> 00:47:25,460
if you are trying to
reduce crowds on your farm

1004
00:47:25,460 --> 00:47:28,410
that you're still accepting
or will be accepting

1005
00:47:28,410 --> 00:47:33,410
time ticketing or other
preregistration for events,

1006
00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:35,860
activities and so forth.

1007
00:47:35,860 --> 00:47:37,630
So I'd be curious to know

1008
00:47:37,630 --> 00:47:39,930
if anybody has thoughts
or concerns about that

1009
00:47:39,930 --> 00:47:42,953
in their operations and what
you're thinking if you do.

1010
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:45,700
That's a great question, Brian

1011
00:47:45,700 --> 00:47:48,370
and I'll invite anyone who has thoughts,

1012
00:47:48,370 --> 00:47:50,880
type it into the chat or raise your hand

1013
00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:55,880
and we'll unmute you and you can share.

1014
00:47:55,980 --> 00:47:58,430
In the meantime though while
you're thinking of an answer

1015
00:47:58,430 --> 00:48:01,790
for that, we've got another
question that I sure don't know

1016
00:48:01,790 --> 00:48:03,470
how to answer.

1017
00:48:03,470 --> 00:48:05,347
Which is a question from Richard,

1018
00:48:05,347 --> 00:48:08,567
"What is our responsibility
to our employees

1019
00:48:08,567 --> 00:48:13,177
"if they do not want to get
vaccinated and then get sick

1020
00:48:13,177 --> 00:48:14,550
"with the virus?"

1021
00:48:14,550 --> 00:48:16,690
Anyone wanna take a shot at that one?

1022
00:48:16,690 --> 00:48:19,570
- Michelle bounced it to
me and I think Meredith

1023
00:48:19,570 --> 00:48:22,320
is also part of the
team that's working here

1024
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:26,473
on trying to assist our farmers in any way

1025
00:48:26,473 --> 00:48:31,263
that we can to help get
their labor force vaccinated.

1026
00:48:32,460 --> 00:48:35,860
But it's still a personal choice on there

1027
00:48:36,970 --> 00:48:39,203
and you can't force them.

1028
00:48:40,130 --> 00:48:44,610
Although, I did hear from
one legal advisor that says,

1029
00:48:44,610 --> 00:48:48,333
yes, you can make that a
condition of employment.

1030
00:48:49,700 --> 00:48:53,280
I see a Ben Casella from
New Jersey Farm Bureau

1031
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:58,280
also showed his face which
means he might wanna respond

1032
00:48:59,070 --> 00:49:00,070
to this as well.

1033
00:49:00,070 --> 00:49:03,320
But certainly I don't know that there's

1034
00:49:03,320 --> 00:49:08,320
any legal responsibility
but that would be something

1035
00:49:08,870 --> 00:49:11,993
that a good lawyer is going
to have to advise you on.

1036
00:49:11,993 --> 00:49:16,300
And, or we need to dig it out
of the Department of Labor.

1037
00:49:16,300 --> 00:49:18,153
Ben, you wanna respond?

1038
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:20,820
- Sure, Rick.

1039
00:49:20,820 --> 00:49:24,340
My name is Ben Casella, I work
for New Jersey Farm Bureau.

1040
00:49:24,340 --> 00:49:26,730
And I handle a lot of the labor issues

1041
00:49:26,730 --> 00:49:29,240
for the Farm Bureau in New Jersey.

1042
00:49:29,240 --> 00:49:34,240
And what Rick said is on
point as far as you know,

1043
00:49:37,130 --> 00:49:38,510
there's been a lot of discussion.

1044
00:49:38,510 --> 00:49:41,800
Can you mandate vaccinations?

1045
00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:46,757
There's been some written
determinations based on guidelines

1046
00:49:48,070 --> 00:49:52,420
from the EOC that you
can, I know our advice

1047
00:49:52,420 --> 00:49:55,940
is you definitely want to
consult with your attorney

1048
00:49:55,940 --> 00:49:58,280
before you put those practices in.

1049
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:01,040
I know there has been
some farms in other states

1050
00:50:01,040 --> 00:50:05,180
have done that but in
answer to the question

1051
00:50:05,180 --> 00:50:09,520
I mean in New Jersey, we
have a paid sick leave law.

1052
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:12,600
So if a worker does get sick

1053
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:15,680
they're obligated to collect
40 hours of sick time.

1054
00:50:15,680 --> 00:50:20,393
So there is an obligation as
far as missing work and pay.

1055
00:50:21,230 --> 00:50:25,790
Then we also have guidelines
for farm workers in New Jersey

1056
00:50:25,790 --> 00:50:28,950
from our Department of Health
and Department of Labor.

1057
00:50:28,950 --> 00:50:33,950
And within that you're obligated
to provide some services

1058
00:50:35,060 --> 00:50:38,330
as far as quarantine area
and so forth to meet that.

1059
00:50:38,330 --> 00:50:41,940
So there is still a responsibility

1060
00:50:41,940 --> 00:50:45,320
from the employer to workers that are sick

1061
00:50:46,950 --> 00:50:51,800
and it is an issue as far as
if they deny to get vaccinated

1062
00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:54,910
that's a decision of the employee

1063
00:50:54,910 --> 00:50:57,240
and then a decision of the employer

1064
00:50:57,240 --> 00:50:59,400
how they want to handle that.

1065
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:02,130
But like I said, it's
something that would be needed

1066
00:51:02,130 --> 00:51:04,053
to be handled carefully.

1067
00:51:05,210 --> 00:51:07,650
And with consultation with your attorney

1068
00:51:07,650 --> 00:51:10,030
is the best advice I could give.

1069
00:51:10,030 --> 00:51:10,863
- Thanks, Ben.

1070
00:51:12,000 --> 00:51:14,290
We're getting close to the top of the hour

1071
00:51:14,290 --> 00:51:17,330
and I wanna be respectful
of everyone's time.

1072
00:51:17,330 --> 00:51:20,340
So I've got a few minutes
of closing remarks

1073
00:51:20,340 --> 00:51:23,050
just basically telling
you what's coming up next.

1074
00:51:23,050 --> 00:51:27,170
But before I show a final
slide and talk about

1075
00:51:27,170 --> 00:51:30,780
what's coming up next in terms
of these online sessions,

1076
00:51:30,780 --> 00:51:32,860
I just wanna turn to Michelle, Brian

1077
00:51:32,860 --> 00:51:37,560
and the rest of the Rutgers
crew, closing remarks,

1078
00:51:37,560 --> 00:51:40,593
last questions you wanna
make sure we touch on today.

1079
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:42,940
- I'll start and let Brian finish.

1080
00:51:42,940 --> 00:51:45,400
But I just wanna say thank
you, Lisa, for inviting us.

1081
00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:48,410
And if anyone needs
getting contact with us,

1082
00:51:48,410 --> 00:51:52,230
our information's on our website,
the checklists are there,

1083
00:51:52,230 --> 00:51:55,070
there's other resources
too, we have training videos

1084
00:51:55,070 --> 00:51:57,800
for on farm safety, for agritourism,

1085
00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:00,500
as well as some slide sets
for ag service providers

1086
00:52:00,500 --> 00:52:03,360
or Extension people like
can be used generically

1087
00:52:03,360 --> 00:52:05,070
if you're doing any trainings.

1088
00:52:05,070 --> 00:52:07,700
And I wanna thank Brian
because he really got the ball

1089
00:52:07,700 --> 00:52:09,760
rolling in New Jersey with that grant.

1090
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:12,850
And it's been I guess,
gosh, 11 and 12 years ago,

1091
00:52:12,850 --> 00:52:14,550
we completed that project.

1092
00:52:14,550 --> 00:52:16,217
But thank you again.

1093
00:52:16,217 --> 00:52:19,380
And we look forward to
participating more in the future.

1094
00:52:19,380 --> 00:52:21,550
- And I'll just add Lisa, thank you again

1095
00:52:21,550 --> 00:52:23,510
as I said, my opening comments

1096
00:52:23,510 --> 00:52:25,330
we're all trying to figure this out folks.

1097
00:52:25,330 --> 00:52:28,470
And in some cases the grower
community is ahead of us.

1098
00:52:28,470 --> 00:52:31,900
In other cases, we're
trying to get information

1099
00:52:31,900 --> 00:52:34,950
more proactively so I think the good news

1100
00:52:34,950 --> 00:52:37,690
is that since signals are positive,

1101
00:52:37,690 --> 00:52:39,240
we're going in the right direction

1102
00:52:39,240 --> 00:52:42,310
but I would just really
urge careful consideration.

1103
00:52:42,310 --> 00:52:45,770
And as I said, my new kind
of catchphrase these days

1104
00:52:45,770 --> 00:52:49,430
is just be conspicuous with
your efforts to do things right,

1105
00:52:49,430 --> 00:52:52,000
right in terms of obviously compliance

1106
00:52:52,000 --> 00:52:54,200
but also right in terms
of what the consumer

1107
00:52:54,200 --> 00:52:57,290
or the customer expects because ultimately

1108
00:52:58,750 --> 00:53:00,800
there's going to be a
lot of perception issues

1109
00:53:00,800 --> 00:53:03,730
and comfort levels that
you're gonna have to contend

1110
00:53:03,730 --> 00:53:06,190
with outside of what
states executive orders

1111
00:53:06,190 --> 00:53:08,550
or federal guidance dictates.

1112
00:53:08,550 --> 00:53:12,340
So we're here to serve you,
we might not have the answers.

1113
00:53:12,340 --> 00:53:16,040
I was laughing when Stuart
Farnham made his comment,

1114
00:53:16,040 --> 00:53:17,540
we don't have all the answers either

1115
00:53:17,540 --> 00:53:20,420
but we're certainly here to work with you.

1116
00:53:20,420 --> 00:53:22,300
- Brian and Michelle and Rick

1117
00:53:22,300 --> 00:53:24,970
and the rest of the folks from Rutgers.

1118
00:53:24,970 --> 00:53:26,730
Thank you so much for joining us today

1119
00:53:26,730 --> 00:53:29,530
and thanks to everyone
else who joined us today.

1120
00:53:29,530 --> 00:53:32,690
Those of you who registered
and sent questions in advance

1121
00:53:32,690 --> 00:53:35,070
as well as folks are typing into chat

1122
00:53:35,070 --> 00:53:40,070
and unmuting and sharing
your stories and experiences.

1123
00:53:40,300 --> 00:53:43,110
We're planning to do a series of these

1124
00:53:43,110 --> 00:53:45,230
for the next few Tuesdays.

1125
00:53:45,230 --> 00:53:49,500
So next Tuesday, same time again with Gad,

1126
00:53:49,500 --> 00:53:52,890
a colleague from Rutgers
talking about crisis management

1127
00:53:52,890 --> 00:53:56,570
and communications for
farms open to visitors.

1128
00:53:56,570 --> 00:53:58,550
So dealing with the question of

1129
00:53:58,550 --> 00:54:00,600
what if something goes wrong?

1130
00:54:00,600 --> 00:54:02,050
How do you deal with it?

1131
00:54:02,050 --> 00:54:05,100
And also how do you communicate?

1132
00:54:05,100 --> 00:54:07,120
How do you tell your story

1133
00:54:07,120 --> 00:54:10,700
about what happened on the
farm rather than just being

1134
00:54:10,700 --> 00:54:14,580
at the mercy of media?

1135
00:54:14,580 --> 00:54:16,860
How do you manage the PR as well

1136
00:54:16,860 --> 00:54:19,840
as how do you deal with
the actual situation?

1137
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:22,890
And then the next Tuesday, May 25th,

1138
00:54:22,890 --> 00:54:26,090
we've got a noontime
session with Stuart Farnum

1139
00:54:26,090 --> 00:54:28,253
talking about liability insurance.

1140
00:54:29,090 --> 00:54:31,940
And then planning head to June 1st,

1141
00:54:31,940 --> 00:54:36,400
we're looking at farm and
food safety in particular.

1142
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:38,100
And we're working with some colleagues

1143
00:54:38,100 --> 00:54:41,560
at University of New Hampshire
Extension, Mary Choate

1144
00:54:41,560 --> 00:54:44,380
and Jada Lindblom and they are working

1145
00:54:44,380 --> 00:54:46,560
with a couple of farms in New Hampshire

1146
00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:50,960
and are doing videos, guided
tours of best practices

1147
00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:53,850
and considerations.

1148
00:54:53,850 --> 00:54:57,380
So that will be a fun one
where we've got some videos.

1149
00:54:57,380 --> 00:55:01,040
All of this information is on our website

1150
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:04,450
and Carrie we'll put the
website link into the chat

1151
00:55:04,450 --> 00:55:07,130
so you can click right on
it if you wanna register,

1152
00:55:07,130 --> 00:55:09,850
we'll also follow up with an email

1153
00:55:09,850 --> 00:55:13,590
and I'll mention that one
other part of this program.

1154
00:55:13,590 --> 00:55:17,390
So we're able to do this thanks to support

1155
00:55:17,390 --> 00:55:19,680
from the Northeast
Extension Risk Management

1156
00:55:19,680 --> 00:55:23,430
Education Center funded
by a grant from the USDA,

1157
00:55:23,430 --> 00:55:26,430
National Institute of
Food and Agriculture.

1158
00:55:26,430 --> 00:55:30,810
And part of the grant also
allows for on-farm visits.

1159
00:55:30,810 --> 00:55:35,410
So we've got a team of
folks led by Chadley Hollis

1160
00:55:35,410 --> 00:55:38,150
out of Vermont, but
working with colleagues

1161
00:55:38,150 --> 00:55:41,970
throughout the Northeast, who
is willing to visit farms.

1162
00:55:41,970 --> 00:55:44,393
So like Brian was saying
right at the beginning,

1163
00:55:45,240 --> 00:55:48,540
a farmer can walk around
with their eyes closed

1164
00:55:48,540 --> 00:55:51,910
and they know where all the obstacles are,

1165
00:55:51,910 --> 00:55:52,980
where are the barriers are.

1166
00:55:52,980 --> 00:55:56,030
And that they're not
even thinking about it,

1167
00:55:56,030 --> 00:55:59,353
can be really helpful to
get a fresh set of eyes.

1168
00:55:59,353 --> 00:56:01,820
Someone who's never been to your farm

1169
00:56:01,820 --> 00:56:04,353
and who's walking around like a visitor.

1170
00:56:05,610 --> 00:56:08,100
So if that's something
you're interested in,

1171
00:56:08,100 --> 00:56:10,300
go to our website and there's a form there

1172
00:56:10,300 --> 00:56:13,130
that you can fill out
and then we'll coordinate

1173
00:56:13,130 --> 00:56:16,210
with colleagues in the respective states,

1174
00:56:16,210 --> 00:56:18,440
wherever you happen to be in the Northeast

1175
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:20,650
and plan a farm visit and work with you

1176
00:56:20,650 --> 00:56:22,160
on a farm safety plan.

1177
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:24,160
And that's about it for tonight.

1178
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:28,060
So in closing, I just wanna once again

1179
00:56:28,060 --> 00:56:30,330
thank all of you and hopefully

1180
00:56:30,330 --> 00:56:35,030
we'll see you again next Tuesday
or perhaps another Tuesday

1181
00:56:35,030 --> 00:56:37,140
and maybe even on your farm.

1182
00:56:37,140 --> 00:56:38,493
Thanks so much, everyone.